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A second Reform MS has declared the British Empire was a “force for good” during a debate on Wales’ place within the United Kingdom.
Gŵyr Abertawe MS, Francesca O’Brien, told members “the United Kingdom is the greatest nation in the history of the world.”
She said: “We gave parliamentary democracy, common law and the industrial age.
“We defeated Napoleon. We abolished the slave trade—sorry to disappoint you. We stood against Hitler in 1940 when the rest of Europe had fallen.”
Ms O’Brien continued: “At every one of those moments, Wales was there. Wales has been at the centre of British history for generations.
“In 1485, Henry Tudor, a Welshman born in Pembroke castle, landed near Milford Haven. He marched through Wales, gathering men to his banner, the Red Dragon, and he took the crown at Bosworth.
“His granddaughter Queen Elizabeth I began the British empire, which was such a force for good in the world.”
Her comments came during a debate, tabled by Reform UK, which called for the Senedd to agree Wales should remain in the UK.
They also follow criticism from Plaid Cymru MS Carrie Harper who, earlier in the debate, condemned comments made by Reform’s Joe Martin last week praising the British Empire.
The Fflint Wrecsam MS said Mr Martin’s comments say something about “the political imagination on offer”.
She suggested Reform look backwards “to an idea of what they believe Britain once was”, whereas Plaid Cymru look forward to “what Cymru can become.”
Her party tabled an amendment to the motion, stating that “Wales’ constitutional future should be determined by the people of Wales.”
“Proud Unionist”
Leader of the Welsh Conservatives, Darren Millar, emphasised the pro-union standing of his party, declaring the UK a “shared family of nations”.
Mr Millar said: “We built industries together, we went through the industrial revolution together, we fought tyranny together, we created wealth, improved living standards and built communities together, and our history is Welsh and British.
“And those identities are not in conflict with one another; they strengthen who and what we are.”
He called on Plaid Cymru to answer what he described as the “most basic of questions” on what would happen if Wales were to be “ripped from the rest of the UK”.
The Tory leader pressed for confirmation on what currency an independent Wales would use, who the head of state would be, and if Wales would seek to rejoin the European Union.
Mr Millar concluded: “You cannot answer these things. And they’re not technicalities; these concern people’s jobs, savings, mortgages, pensions, national security and our clout on the international stage.
“I’m not prepared to take that risk. I firmly believe that Wales is better off in the United Kingdom and that the United Kingdom is better off with Wales right at the very centre of everything that it does.”
“Best outcomes”
Minister for the constitution, Dafydd Trystan Davies, stressed that the “constitutional settlement is not static”.
Describing his party’s amendment as a “simple one”, he noted it does not ask members to give up their views but instead acknowledges the principle that Wales’ future is for the Welsh people to decide.
He told members his government’s priorities for devolution are clear, pressing for rail infrastructure, justice and policing, and the Crown Estate to be passed into Welsh control.
Mr Trystan Davies said: “Our objective isn’t to move powers between institutions, but to ensure responsibilities sit at the level where they can be exercised most effectively and deliver the best outcomes for people and communities”
Responding to the Minister, Reform’s James Evans declared the United Kingdom the “second greatest union” in his life – following his marriage.
He supported Ms O’Brien’s speech, adding: “You highlighted the United Kingdom is the best country in this world, and I think everybody in this Chamber should agree with that.
“We should not be ashamed of our shared history. We should not be ashamed of our world history, either. Britain built the world.
“You’ve talked about how Welsh people have shaped our globe, how we have improved democracy, how we have brought freedoms to people around the globe.”
Mr Evans continued: “And I’m afraid to say what we see in this Chamber is political opportunism by others rewriting our history to suit a political narrative to rip our country apart.”
The Reform motion was rejected by the Senedd with 45 votes for and 46 against with the Llywydd exercising his casting vote.
The Senedd did, however, agree the Plaid Cymru amendment by 53 votes to 37.
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