Opposition leaders clash with First Minister over Welsh independence

First Minister Rhun ap Iorwerth clashed with opposition party leaders over independence and Wales’ place in the UK following his attendance at a YesCymru rally.

On Saturday September 26, the First Minister attended a YesCymru rally in Aberystwyth where he declared Wales was “on a journey”.

However, Mr ap Iorwerth faced backlash today, Tuesday September 29, from the leaders of Reform UK and the Welsh Conservatives during First Minister’s Questions.

“Constitutional naval-glazing”

Welsh Conservatives leader, Darren Millar, questioned Mr ap Iorwerth on how it felt to have “recruited Russian Foreign Minister, Sergey Lavrov, to [the] campaign to break up the United Kingdom”.

Mr Millar told members Mr Lavrov has been “gleefully speaking” about the potential of referendums on the future of the UK.

He said: “Are you pleased to have Putin’s Russia cheerleading on this independence mission that you’ve set yourself on, or do you finally realise the folly of focusing on that issue and the constitutional navel-gazing, rather than cracking on with improving our sliding educational standards, getting to grips with the crisis in our NHS, and trying to fire up the Welsh economy?”

The First Minister emphasised the constitutional future of Wales is a matter for the people of Wales, and said: “It isn’t for the Kremlin to endorse, to oppose, or to exploit. 

“The leader of the Conservative group – along with the Secretary of State for Wales, I should say, because they are on the same page, it seems – may wish to reflect on the wisdom of quoting a Kremlin propagandist in order to pursue their unionist agenda here.”

The Tory leader then reminded Mr ap Iorwerth that he told the people of Wales that the 2026 election was not about independence.

Adding: “Yet since that election, you have done everything to make this Senedd about the issue of independence. 

“You either clearly didn’t get the memo that you wrote yourself, or you deliberately misled the people of Wales and tried to get them to vote for Plaid by seeking to dampen down your aspirations for an independent Wales.”

Responding, the First Minister said it feels as though “there’s an attempt every week to draw a big rabbit out of a hat that the leader of Plaid Cymru believes in independence for Wales”  – a fact that he said does not “come as a surprise”.

“Insulting”

Reform’s leader, Helen Jenner, told the First Minister his priorities are “frankly insulting”.

Noting that his government failed to pass its supplementary budget, she said: “Instead of signing pacts with dangerous separatists, instead of preaching to the converted at independence rallies, you should be making calls to the leaders and finance spokespeople in this Chamber to bring consensus.

“We have made it clear that we’ll vote for a budget that puts the people of Wales first: no more money going overseas; no more cash for trees in Africa.”

Suggesting Ms Jenner is “obsessed” with constitutional matters, Mr ap Iorwerth reiterated his government is “getting on with the job of governing Wales”.

He added: “She talks about insulting the people of Wales. We can see under her leadership already this lurch to the right. 

“The fact that she didn’t condemn the appalling comments from the shadow Minister without portfolio – without principles, without any shame – says so much about her leadership of Reform in Wales.”

The comments referred to were made by Caerdydd Penarth MS Joe Martin last week during a debate on the pause in scheduled treatments for trans patients.

In the debate Mr Martin said: “The Welsh Gender Service should be closed forever and the doctors in the UK who performed surgeries on children should be imprisoned for what they’ve done.

“And if Reform form a government in Westminster in 2029, I’ll be making representations to our colleagues there that justice be served to the liars and the butchers responsible for what’s happened to what’s left of the young people who have had surgery performed.”

Mr Martin’s words were deemed to have breached Standing Order 13.9(v) as it constituted ‘disorderly, discriminatory or offensive language or language which detracts from the dignity of the Senedd’.

The Llywydd, Huw Irranca-Davies, said he had written to Mr Martin regarding the ruling.